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Sony TV Line-up 2015

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Offline Xerox

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #15 on: 30 January 2015, 02:29:48 PM »

Current consumer products like cameras use 4:4:4 for output.

Offline David Mackenzie

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #16 on: 30 January 2015, 09:19:45 PM »
DSLRs in the still mode, yes. (Although you do need to take bayer filtering into account).
Everything else, nope.
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Offline Xerox

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #17 on: 02 February 2015, 03:16:41 PM »
DSLRs in the still mode, yes. (Although you do need to take bayer filtering into account).
Everything else, nope.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqEXNZXZVII&x-yt-ts=1422579428&x-yt-cl=85114404

Video and picture is 4:4:4 even on non DSLR cameras like mirror less.

You don't have to use a full frame sensor to capture 4:4:4 you know, so you can have 4:4:4 on cheaper model under 500 euro too.

Now with Sony A7 full frame mirroless at under 1500 euro with lens included there is no longer a problem with full frame cameras for consumers.

Offline David Mackenzie

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #18 on: 02 February 2015, 06:15:47 PM »
Quote
Video and picture is 4:4:4 even on non DSLR cameras like mirror less.
Wrong. (Nearly?) all DSLRs shoot in 4:2:0 in the video mode.

Quote
You don't have to use a full frame sensor to capture 4:4:4 you know, so you can have 4:4:4 on cheaper model under 500 euro too.
Reading full chroma from the sensor means nothing when it goes through a 4:2:0 path.
« Last Edit: 02 February 2015, 08:01:12 PM by David Mackenzie »
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Offline Xerox

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #19 on: 03 February 2015, 11:23:11 AM »
Read this technique please David :

http://www.eoshd.com/2014/02/discovery-4k-8bit-420-panasonic-gh4-converts-1080p-10bit-444/

Quite impressive for how to get 1080p 10 bit 4:4:4 video !

Don't you think ?

Long live 1080p !

Offline FoxHounder

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #20 on: 03 February 2015, 11:58:13 AM »
I can totally see an average consumer taking their own TV programme into production, shot with 4K 4:2:0 and then downscaled in professional thousand-bucks workflow to 1080p 4:4:4 with 10 bit upsampling.
That happens every day, sheesh. :P
"Make your own damn movie", as Lloyd Kaufman says.
« Last Edit: 03 February 2015, 12:36:01 PM by FoxHounder »
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Offline Xerox

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #21 on: 03 February 2015, 10:49:39 PM »


Stupid capitalist consumer TVs can't even show to the average user 4:4:4 in order to get that super professional TV programs and ultra professional films and mega professional video content from great professional cameras that only "professional people' use and cost thousands of euros.

Offline David Mackenzie

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #22 on: 04 February 2015, 08:32:55 PM »
Read this technique please David :

http://www.eoshd.com/2014/02/discovery-4k-8bit-420-panasonic-gh4-converts-1080p-10bit-444/

Quite impressive for how to get 1080p 10 bit 4:4:4 video !

Don't you think ?

Long live 1080p !
Yes, since 4:2:0 from 3840x2160 = 1920x1080.
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Offline SETEM

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #23 on: 04 February 2015, 09:17:09 PM »
Read this technique please David :

http://www.eoshd.com/2014/02/discovery-4k-8bit-420-panasonic-gh4-converts-1080p-10bit-444/

Quite impressive for how to get 1080p 10 bit 4:4:4 video !

Don't you think ?

Long live 1080p !
Yes, since 4:2:0 from 3840x2160 = 1920x1080.
Doesn't "4:2:0" simply mean that the chroma (colour) information is halved vertically and halved horizontally compared to the luma (brightness) information?

So, for UHD/4k (3840x2160) in 4:2:0:
  • The horizontal luma info is for 3840 pixels, which means the horizontal chroma info is therefore for 0.5*3840=1920 pixels.
  • The vertical luma info is for 2160 pixels, which means the vertical chroma info is therefore for 0.5*2160=1080 pixels.

Which means that the chroma info for 3840x2160 in 4:2:0 is stored for "only" 1920x1080 pixels (FullHD).

So, if you have some 4k/UHD in 4:2:0 and you "downscale" the luma from 3840x2160 to 1920x1080, while you leave the chroma untouched at 1920x1080, won't you just end up with a material which has 1920x1080 luma AND 1920x1080 chroma? Which is, per definition, Full HD (1920x1080) in 4:4:4? :chin:

(Won't this be true for any such UHD --> FHD where the chroma is left untouched, that is essentially also a 4:2:0 --> 4:4:4 conversion?)


Or am I wrong ???  :huh:
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Offline SETEM

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #24 on: 04 February 2015, 09:24:00 PM »
Stupid capitalist consumer TVs can't even show to the average user 4:4:4...
Quite a few consumer TV's can, according to the reviews here. (Maybe not from USB, as you keep harping on about, but...) 2012's Panasonic VT50 plasma can, but none of the plasmas in their 2013 range can. I wonder why? Probably because it's not very important...
Panasonic TX-P55VT60Y, PS4, PS3, X360, Wii, Pioneer VSX-421, Sony SS-FCR4000 5.0, Yamaha YST-FSW100.
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Offline David Mackenzie

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Re: Sony TV Line-up 2015
« Reply #25 on: 04 February 2015, 10:13:23 PM »
@SETEM: Yes, all correct.

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